Author Topic: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane  (Read 65788 times)

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #60 on: December 06, 2013, 09:41:34 am »


If those in favour of the proposal feel a vote of the entire membership would be more appropriate instead of an AGM vote, it's quite possible to propose that under the current rules. Just make that part of the proposal to the AGM. For example:

"I propose that a membership-wide vote be taken during October to decide whether a fifth British Fantasy Award should have a male writer's name attached to it. The purpose of this proposal is to cement the society's reputation for institutional sexism."

You may decide on slightly different wording, of course.



 Rereading this bit, have I missed a post?

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #61 on: December 06, 2013, 10:00:29 am »
"I propose that a membership-wide vote be taken during October to decide whether a fifth British Fantasy Award should have a male writer's name attached to it. The purpose of this proposal is to cement the society's reputation for institutional sexism."

You may decide on slightly different wording, of course.'

There was no need for that flippancy, Stephen. We are talking about Joel Lane here also. I man we all admired and loved very much.

 
 
 We don't need to define by gender at all. We all know that there are more males in this genre...that doesn't mean anyone is purposefully defined by that.

Offline allybird

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #62 on: December 06, 2013, 10:04:55 am »
'With regard to keeping the conversation civil, it would be good if we could keep the re-writing of posts using the edit function down to a minimum, out of respect for other forum users. It's frustrating to compose a careful reply to a post and then discover that new paragraphs have been inserted into the post to which you're responding.'

You can always check back and see if you have covered everything. But yes I understand.

I was trying to keep it in one place for your reply ...........and look forward to that reply.

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #63 on: December 06, 2013, 10:12:33 am »
Knowing you personally Allyson I know that you wouldn't define by gender, I don't know why it was quoted...

 

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #64 on: December 06, 2013, 12:16:47 pm »
I have to say that I feel a little uncomfortable with what was said...I'm sure you didn't mean it to come out that way Stephen.
 

Offline allybird

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #65 on: December 06, 2013, 02:15:13 pm »
I find it very insensitive. And within it the repetition of the same objection. A better example could have been chosen.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 02:28:08 pm by allybird »

Offline allybird

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #66 on: December 06, 2013, 03:06:26 pm »
As an overseas member I would have to pay 60 ( twice that of the U.K. ) so for that I can't vote at the AGM (no electronic/postal vote in place yet)  journals that come out now and again. No wonder the membership is complaining (journals) and I saw some on this forum saying recently is it worth it for 30? ...........and I ask again how many members are in the BFS currently?

Do we have minutes anywhere on this site...(the last AGM perhaps) and regularly posted each year?
« Last Edit: December 06, 2013, 03:15:40 pm by allybird »

Offline Rolnikov

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #67 on: December 06, 2013, 03:14:29 pm »
Emma, if it made you uncomfortable to see Allyson's proposal worded that way, that's fine - it should. That's exactly why I'm against it. As awards administrator, I am *very* uncomfortable at the thought of how horribly sexist our awards would look if this proposal should pass.

Anyway, my advice is to focus here on how to shape your proposal, discuss with supporters which particular award to focus your effort on, and form a plan for getting the vote out at the AGM. Decide whether you want to have it voted on at the AGM, or if you want the AGM to approve a membership vote. Decide who will propose it, who will speak in favour of it, whether you'll offer funding. Consider the objections, and how you might counter them.

If you're genuinely interested in changing the way in which the rules of the awards can be changed, as opposed to just looking for a shortcut for this proposal, I'd suggest starting a new thread. Here it's a distraction. You can't change that part of the rules any sooner than you can change any other part.

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #68 on: December 06, 2013, 03:17:13 pm »
Stephen, where is the wording itself from Allyson? Which page?
 I saw something about it brought up early on in this thread...can't remember who said it.

Offline allybird

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #69 on: December 06, 2013, 03:25:34 pm »
'Emma, if it made you uncomfortable to see Allyson's proposal worded that way, that's fine - it should.'

Please don't associate me with your example..

Three times you have mentioned your own gender concerns once would have been enough but to have then wrapped it up in that example...well words fail me.

My proposal is a BFS Collection Award in Joel's name.

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #70 on: December 06, 2013, 03:30:41 pm »
Emma, if it made you uncomfortable to see Allyson's proposal worded that way, that's fine - it should. That's exactly why I'm against it. As awards administrator, I am *very* uncomfortable at the thought of how horribly sexist our awards would look if this proposal should pass.

Anyway, my advice is to focus here on how to shape your proposal, discuss with supporters which particular award to focus your effort on, and form a plan for getting the vote out at the AGM. Decide whether you want to have it voted on at the AGM, or if you want the AGM to approve a membership vote. Decide who will propose it, who will speak in favour of it, whether you'll offer funding. Consider the objections, and how you might counter them.

If you're genuinely interested in changing the way in which the rules of the awards can be changed, as opposed to just looking for a shortcut for this proposal, I'd suggest starting a new thread. Here it's a distraction. You can't change that part of the rules any sooner than you can change any other part.

 Actually Stephen, I've just realised what you've said.
 1. Why address me when Allyson has asked what you were inferring?
 2. I've paid for my joint membership only yesterday, I have PAID towards the society's funding already! So, I will have to pay for what exactly? Does everyone in the BFS pay each time a new award is created? NO.
 3. As for the old show of hands voting I say that we need something more reliable, more precise. How could I attend the Open Night in my late friend's honour when there is no wheelchair access?!
 4. As a member of this society for the past four years I find this somewhat insulting. You have directly addressed me. Why? I asked, but I'm not the person feeling slighted by your comment...

 From what you've just stated, it appears that you had already made up your mind on this matter. Why did you not state this earlier? There are some of us still grieving for the loss of a great member of your society. Please bear that in mind.  
 

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #71 on: December 06, 2013, 03:32:15 pm »
'Emma, if it made you uncomfortable to see Allyson's proposal worded that way, that's fine - it should

My proposal is a BFS Collection Award in Joel's name.

 I second that motion.
 Thank you Allyson.

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #72 on: December 06, 2013, 03:36:57 pm »
Emma, if it made you uncomfortable to see Allyson's proposal worded that way, that's fine - it should. That's exactly why I'm against it. As awards administrator, I am *very* uncomfortable at the thought of how horribly sexist our awards would look if this proposal should p

 Gender does not come into this, the massive influence & respect does however.
 I also do not agree on a seperate thread...the title is 'Proposing an award named for Joel Lane' & that is precisely what I am trying to talk about.

Offline allybird

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #73 on: December 06, 2013, 03:39:36 pm »
I should add there are so many things wrong with making grieving friends feel uncomfortable I don't know where to begin.

Offline Emma Audsley1

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Re: Proposing an award named for Joel Lane
« Reply #74 on: December 06, 2013, 04:28:24 pm »
Why can we not work through this civilly?
 There is no need for this from a society I support.