Author Topic: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions  (Read 9520 times)

C.R. Barker

  • Guest
Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« on: September 18, 2006, 08:25:54 pm »
It strikes me that there is a need for a private uncensored message board so that controversial issues can be thrashed out without offending those who don't wish to get involved. I have therefore set up the following group and cordially anyone to join:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/thehorrorsanctuary/

Let me state again very clearly that there will be NO censorship. These are the only rules:

1. Only members will be allowed to post and view the archives.
2. Applicants must disclose their real identity on joining and must have a valid interest in the horror genre i.e. writer, reader, publisher etc.
3. Messages should not be copied from the group into other forums.

Although there will be no censorship, members will be expected to respect each other and to limit personal abuse.

The BFS board is currently unsuitable because it is obvious that most people do not wish to get involved in controversial disagreements; Ramsey Campbell's message board has unfair membership restrictions, the threat of censorship and is viewable to the whole world; and usenet aka Google groups is a dangerous place to post, because few people reveal their real identities and comments are viewable by anyone in the whole world.

The Horror Sanctuary is NOT designed to challenge other general discussion groups. It exists purely as a platform through which warring parties can exchange views in private and without interference from censors or anonymous mischief-makers.

No applications will be refused provided they meet the above three criteria.

CB
THE HAUNTED RIVER
http://hauntedriver.co.uk












Gary Fry

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2006, 11:24:56 am »
Why don't you come to the FCon and air your ideas at the AGM? That's what it's for.

C.R. Barker

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2006, 07:11:34 pm »
Why don't you come to the FCon and air your ideas at the AGM? That's what it's for.

At the risk of giving ammunition to my enemies, because I can't get away from the house for that long. I have two autistic four year olds - I'm their primary carer - and although I wanted to attend with Reggie Oliver to fly the Haunted River / Reggie Oliver flag, it would place too much of a burden upon my wife, who would be home alone with the kids.

Having said that, I can't say that the prospect of having to engage in debate with the likes of Mr Campbell and his entourage of disciples is something that appeals to me (and nor I suspect would it appeal to many others). The cards are, like the BFS set-up itself, stacked very heavily in his favour. I've seen politics in action - both as a councillor and a local govt official - and in my opinion, the way that the BFS is run, led and managed is somewhere between amateur and tinpot.

You are of course more than welcome to join the 'Horror Sanctuary' I've set up. I'm confident that the atmosphere will be pleasanter than exists on other boards when tempers get heated. I'm a better 'moderator' than anyone else I know of, certainly less emotional and prejudiced than Sean Parker, the Roden, John Pelan et al, because I believe that folk should worship at a 'broad church'.

However, I suspect that you won't want to join, Gary, because while you're quite happy being in a group that you control, or an environment where you're backed up by a big gun, you fear having to stand up for yourself alone (as I am quite happy to do). That's a pity, because it would be interesting to pursue certain issues we've touched upon before i.e. schizophrenia, communication misunderstandings etc.

Best of luck with your book launches and your own new collection. Oh, and no pot-smoking in Ramsey's bedroom; you know what the gossips are liable to say about that..... ;)

CB
http://hauntedriver.co.uk






Gary Fry

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2006, 10:05:29 am »
>>>I have two autistic four year olds - I'm their primary carer - and although I wanted to attend with Reggie Oliver to fly the Haunted River / Reggie Oliver flag, it would place too much of a burden upon my wife, who would be home alone with the kids.

Understood.

>>>Having said that, I can't say that the prospect of having to engage in debate with the likes of Mr Campbell and his entourage of disciples is something that appeals to me (and nor I suspect would it appeal to many others). The cards are, like the BFS set-up itself, stacked very heavily in his favour. I've seen politics in action - both as a councillor and a local govt official - and in my opinion, the way that the BFS is run, led and managed is somewhere between amateur and tinpot.

It's run by volunteers and it's clearly a thankless task. Personally I think the organisers should be applauded, and not berated. As I've said before, if you want a system designed to meet your agenda, pay these people a full-time wage. Otherwise, let them do what they do, limitations and all.

>>>You are of course more than welcome to join the 'Horror Sanctuary' I've set up. I'm confident that the atmosphere will be pleasanter than exists on other boards when tempers get heated. I'm a better 'moderator' than anyone else I know of, certainly less emotional and prejudiced than Sean Parker, the Roden, John Pelan et al, because I believe that folk should worship at a 'broad church'.

Why is it not visible to non-members? It shouldn't be. 

>>>However, I suspect that you won't want to join, Gary, because while you're quite happy being in a group that you control, or an environment where you're backed up by a big gun, you fear having to stand up for yourself alone (as I am quite happy to do). That's a pity, because it would be interesting to pursue certain issues we've touched upon before i.e. schizophrenia, communication misunderstandings etc.

Yes, I'd like to talk to you about schizophrenia, too...

>>>Best of luck with your book launches and your own new collection. Oh, and no pot-smoking in Ramsey's bedroom; you know what the gossips are liable to say about that...

Thanks. And always finish with the recency effect, eh? (Look it up in a psychology textbook.)

GF

juzzza

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2006, 01:04:25 pm »
Always been a big fan of the Primacy effect...

Maybe you should have started your post with F Off, Gary!

VirgilKain

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2006, 01:09:16 pm »
It's a shame to see that Mr CR Barker has been moved on.

I know he came across as hard headed (he is a self confessed antagonist) but underneath it all he did have some bloody good ideas.

With fear of saying the wrong thing I really hope some of his suggestions are given some thought over the course of the next year. ;D

David Lee Stone

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2006, 01:37:13 pm »
I agree absolutely. He was obviously very angry and frustrated at the society for his own reasons....but there are many not so 'vocal' members who feel the same way.

Fortunately, I am not one of them.....but I personally have stopped shouting for the time being in order to give the society a chance to take in and action a lot of the good points that I believe have been made over the past few months. I really hope we can see some genuine movement in the coming year...and I am optimistic.


David Lee Stone

DFL

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2006, 05:26:43 pm »
I have no axe to grind *for* or *against* anyone, but CRB's discrete yahoogroups forum has been interesting on a few topics.

DFL

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2006, 05:39:40 pm »
Having said that, I thought the 'Peter' who came on a thread recently as the phantom of the opera was a tiny bit heavy-handed.
des

Offline Wayne Mook

  • Barbarian Monarch
  • ****
  • Posts: 773
    • View Profile
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #9 on: October 01, 2006, 04:59:14 pm »
I agree Des. it did seem a bit heavy, after all he was called immature and a few other things, but these were not challenged. Even though I did not agree with him and on somethings he was wrong. I would have liked to hear his views some more even though I know there is some history.

Wayne.

Peter

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2006, 10:17:34 am »
I would agree that the exchange of ideas is a good thing, I would agree that frank discussion is a good thing. However, when this is coloured by personal dislikes the value becomes lost in the general negativity, unfortunate but true. While some ideas may have had merit, adopting opposite sides of the same argument based on who happens to hold the counter view  is not valuable, nor does it contain any sincerity in it's intent to "improve" the society, it becomes simply another opportunity to take a jab. The other unfortunate side effect is the overall negativity causes anything of genuine value to be missed, people just get tired of reading the same old diatribes..

I had previously warned that repeating the behaviour would result in removal, I simply followed through with what I had said. We could have course gone back and forth on it repeatedly, following the normal pattern of the argument skipping from thread to thread spoiling any genuine discussions going on and culminating in the same result, but I see no reason to do so, repeating the cycle just makes the atmosphere worse.

So to conclude, all suggestions/comments or criticisms welcome and open for discussion, this can only be beneficial to the Society as a whole in moving forward, but let's keep the personal vendettas personal and in a more suitable venue.

Graham Joyce

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2006, 11:21:15 am »
I agree with Pete & I don't think he was being heavy handed.  In fact the poster in question had been treated with a lot of toleration and was still using this board to make pretty serious allegations and rather insulting "invitations".  Now, had that poster received a show of support on these boards, then the debate should and must continue.  But this was NOT the case.  I think the moderator waits to see if the support is there, then if there is no support the moderator steps in so as to disallow one person a completely disproportionate amplification of provocative views.  It's like controlling the microphone at a panel or a formal meeting: you can't surrender responsibility for the air-waves in a public space.  Web-boards unfortunately grant space without responsibility, and one consequence is endless recapitulation of the same points.  This is not censorship: anyone is at perfect liberty to continue the debate on another board, but, because of the disproportionate and unsupported negativity, the Society is saying "Not here please".

DFL

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2006, 12:05:09 pm »
Well, having put my head above the parapet following my re-joining the BFS in recent weeks, I shall now lower it.  :-)

But not before saying:

I can only respect the words above:

because of the disproportionate and unsupported negativity, the Society is saying "Not here please".

if that is the official view.

However, generally, I don't think a web message board like this is the same as a public meeting: the latter is finite whilst these boards are potentially 'infinite' - wide-ranging dicussions on various threads; boards that can be locked; new threads started; the vibrancy of debate (perhaps sometimes angry); views proposed and countered at leisure; etc etc.

I am a Moderator in places elsewhere.  I only ban people because of blatant spamming, obscenity, illegalities etc.


I can't remember all CRB's posts but they seemed cogently argued and deeply felt, sometimes angry. 

I don't know enough to agree or disagree with most of his points.  But they brought a lot more attention to these boards (as a by-product).

I know he was wrong, in my mind, about some matters concerning people.  Such views  need to be addressed.  He still believes what he said.

I've never met CRB, never had personal correspondence with him, never seen his work in the field.  In fact I don't know who he is other than what I've seen recently on the net.

I have no axe to grind.

Head now lowered.

des



Graham Joyce

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2006, 12:56:08 pm »
No need to lower your head Des!  I know some people cherish the untrammeled freedom of webboards and I respect that, too.  I don't know Mr Barker either & like you I've no axe etc.  In fact he's made some good points here but they're lost inside a slew of personal attacks that the rest of us know nothing about.  It's always mildly diverting for the rest of us to see someone "having a go" but when there appears to be no substance and no support from other members it becomes like reading things scribbled on a bog wall.  A genuine controversy however, with lots of people wading in on each side is a very different thing and I'd very much against the society controlling that. 

Peter

  • Guest
Re: Uncensored private board for controversial genre discussions
« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2006, 01:23:13 pm »
I think that's the main point here. Any time on any board that something occurs like this it attracts attention in much the same way as a schoolyard fight generates a crowd, simple human nature. In the short term it attracts traffic but over the long term it becomes "oh no not again", the results of that are that any of the valid points raised become overlooked, once any thread it moves to gets hijacked and turned to the same old argument others cease posting, and ultimately people just stop posting as they stop seeing the point.

I would encourage anyone to express a viewpoint and I'm sure that the ensuing debates will at times become heated, I don't see that as an issue, but let's keep personal attacks out of it.